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Parents of lost babies and potential of all kinds: come here to share the technicolour, the vividness, the despair, the heart-broken-open, the compassion we learn for others, having been through this mess — and see it reflected back at you, acknowledged and understood.

Thanks to photographer Xin Li and to artist Stephanie Sicore for their respective illustrations and photos.

ttc | pregnancy | birth after loss > PAL IVF

Hello everyone,

I just found this website and am finding a lot of comfort and peace from the community already. I had my amazing little girl m, Etta Edith, on April 16 at just 22weeks6day gestation. I had a sub chrionic hematoma which caused my water to break at 21weeks. Etta lived for an amazing 44 days before passing away after a battle with pulmonary hypertension and a large pda. My pregnancy with her was perfect up until I started bleeding at 20 weeks, which was quickly followed by the series of horrible circumstances that led to her premature birth.

I am absolutely devastated, heartbroken, wrecked because of her death but my husband and I want to try for another baby as soon as possible. Our generalist said it was better to wait longer (Etta was born vaginally) but I feel like I’m ready to be pregnant. We tried for two years to get pregnant with Etta, finally conceiving with IVF (I have/had a condition that caused me to be annovulatory). There is a chance I will ovulate now and my husband and I are not trying to stop conception.

My questions are:
How long did moms of other preemies wait to conceive?
How long after you stopped pumping and/or after you gave birth did you get your first period?
If anyone used IVF, how long did you wait before you had another embryo transferred?

I already have an appointment with our fertility clinic for the end of July. I just turned 33 and am concerned about waiting too long and Etta was our first. I am hopeful that I can conceive naturally but am not holding my breath.

Sending love to all of the other moms out there. I feel you all and know your love for your little ones, living or no longer with us.

One last question: best books to read for grief?

Etta’s Mom
July 2, 2020 | Unregistered CommenterEtta’s mom
Hi Etta’s mom,

I am so sorry for the devastating loss of your sweet baby girl. It is so very hard to understand why such a terrible thing can happen. I had a similar but slightly different circumstance- I lost my first child, a daughter named Mira, at 21 weeks due to a presumed placental abruption. This was one year ago on July 4, 2019 and she passed pretty much immediately. I remember those feelings of longing in the early months, desperate to be pregnant again. I was 33 when I lost her so I too was very worried about my age and getting older. I will answer your questions in order below:

1. We waited exactly 6 months before trying again. In those 6 months I grieved heavily for 4 of them. I then spent some time doing a lot of mental work. Like you, I very much wanted to just get pregnant again right away. My husband, a very wise man, pointed out that we needed to be ready for anything. We needed to be mentally ready to have difficulty getting pregnant, or perhaps we would get pregnant right away. What would we do if we had another loss? How would we cope? We spent a lot of time talking through the different scenarios and what it would mean for us mentally, physically, spiritually etc. ultimately at the 6 month mark, it felt right. I still grieved for Mira a lot and always will, but to us it felt like we had her as our guardian angel now. We were very fortunate to conceive on the first try and we are now 30 weeks pregnant. I cannot stress enough though how important it is to be gentle with yourself. The rollercoaster of emotions continues for many months. I don’t necessarily think there is a one size fits all time frame for trying again but I do believe everyone needs to look deep within themselves and ask hard questions to make sure you’re ready on your own timeline. Being pregnant again has brought many many anxieties with it and I have had to work hard to remember I can’t control most of this. I can only stay healthy and follow doctor’s orders but then just let go and let it be. It has been very hard to do that. That would be another big piece of advice- be prepared to face new anxieties. Since we are all part of this “exclusive baby loss club,” we have worries that so many other mothers are blissfully ignorant of.

2. I got my first period about 6 weeks after losing Mira. I bled for two, and then started having regular periods at 6 weeks. This was unusual for me bc I NEVER had regular periods before that.

3. Did not do IVf so can’t answer that question from a personal standpoint but my good friend who also lost her IVF baby at 21 weeks waited about 4.5-5 months before a new transfer.

4. My favorite book for grief was a book of daily quotations by Martha Hickman called “Healing After Loss.” I also found my local baby loss support group and the friends I made through that group to be my cornerstones of support. After our loss, several friends reached out and put me in contact with baby loss parents they knew, and that was also incredibly helpful. They were all in various stages- some decades our, some were fresh, some had children after and some hadn’t tried yet. I found solace in them when I either needed hope, and at other times when I just needed to vent, scream, curse and be angry that this happened to us.

Sending you love and hope and I will be thinking of your Etta.

Mira’s mom
July 5, 2020 | Unregistered CommenterMira’s mom
Etta's Mom,
I was waiting for more hopeful replies to your post, but also did not want to leave you hanging. Etta - what a beautiful name, fitting such a strong, amazing fighter. I'm with you in the devastation, heartbreak, and wreckage. My beloved twin girls, finally conceived after 6 years of trying, were born far too soon at 21 weeks and 2 days on September 28, 2017. They were immeasurably strong and fought to meet us - born breathing and sacs intact after a week of hospitalization - passing peacefully in our arms. I have an incompetent cervix. I could not imagine losing them after trying and wishing for them for so long, and to some extent still find it unbelievable.

I'm not sure how helpful my journey will be to you, but am more than willing to share in case it does in some way. The MFM suggested I wait a year after they were born vaginally to try again. I contacted my RE to give her the tragic update and she recommended I try again ASAP given my infertility. I was 38 at the time and used follicle stimulating hormone injections and timed intercourse to conceive the girls. My husband and I felt ready and deeply wanted more children. I think it helped me to have something to focus on and move forward in some way. My ob-gyn was surprised at how quickly my period returned - a month after they were born. My milk came in, but I did my best to stop lactation, which took about a week. My RE recommended IVF to reduce the chance of twins, which I started 3.5 months after they were born. Unfortunately, IVF only yielded two eggs, with one immature and the other already degenerating. Fast forward nearly 3 years of back-to-back treatments of some kind (medicated cycles with IUI or timed intercourse) and our dreams remain out of reach. I have had 2 early miscarriages related to poor egg quality. We are pursuing other avenues like egg donor and domestic infant adoption at this point, but those paths themselves are a process and it took time before we were ready to pursue them. I hope my journey does not bring you down too much - it is but one experience and I believe I am in the minority because I have watched many others become pregnant after loss.

I have not read many grief books, relying on online communities and resources more (my attention span has shortened since the girls). The "on the bookshelf" page on this website has recommendations. I appreciated, "Notes for the Everlost: A field guide to grief," by the creator of this community because it focused on babyloss, a grief I find separate from others.

In the end, I think only you and your husband can decide what and when works for you. Give each other grace and kindness when you're each trying to figure that out for yourself and communicate it. I hope you have supportive medical providers that will provide patient-centered care. Much love and light to you. I, and the GITW community, are here for and with you.
July 5, 2020 | Unregistered Commentert
Dear Etta's Mom,

I am so sorry to hear about the loss of your dear daughter, Etta. It's such an incredibly difficult and heartbreaking experience but it is great that you've found this forum of amazingly strong and sympathetic women to help support you through it. I recently lost my son at 21 weeks in March and although we haven't started to try again yet, I wanted to share what I've been told by my doctors in case it's at all helpful.

Here's my responses to your questions:

1. Immediately after my loss, my OB told me that I should wait at least 2-3 months before trying again but recommended waiting six months to be more conservative. I later consulted a couple of MFMs who told me that I could start trying after 3 cycles. They said that they typically tell women who have premies to wait longer but in my case they felt like I should be ok physically to start after 3 cycles since my loss was likely due to cervical insufficiency. I think every situation is different though so would defer to your doctor's recommendations.

2. My period came six weeks after I gave birth vaginally. I have since had only one other period which came exactly six weeks after my first, so I am assuming that I may now be on a six week regular cycle. Before I was pregnant, I was generally around a 35 day cycle.

3. I did not do IVF so cannot answer your question.

4. I dove into a number of different pregnancy loss books and found that "Empty Cradle, Broken Heart" was a good resource for learning about the reasons behind pregnancy loss, how to cope with grief, etc. The other book that I absolutely loved was a memoir called "An Exact Replica of a Figment of My Imagination" by Elizabeth McCracken which I found on the Library page on this site. It was so beautifully written and was a nice reprieve from all the factual books on loss I was reading. Although her story was heart wrenching, it also had so many moments that made me smile and laugh which was a nice change. I felt parts of my story in hers and I found a lot of inspiration and hope for a future, successful pregnancy. I'd highly recommend it.

I hope that you are staying strong and please do reach out if you need anything at all. Wishing you all the best.
July 6, 2020 | Unregistered Commenteranonymous
Thank you all for your detailed responses. It feels weird to thank you when all I want to do is sit with each of you and hug you. This is miserable and I hate that we are all here, feeling this.

Mira’s mom- how awful. I’m sorry for the loss of your little one. I love the name Mira. Did they ever determine what caused the abruption. And, yes, your husband is wise. I struggle with those thoughts but also know that all of this is out of my control and above all else, I cannot live with myself if we do not try again. Our OB said this is unlikely to happen again, not that it couldn’t happen but the chances were smaller than the chances of reoccurrence; however, I continue to wrestle with the fact it could happen again and spiral into thoughts of despair. It doesn’t help that I continue to read horror stories on different websites. My mistake for doing any searching. Congratulations on your current pregnancy. Are you seeing a high risk OB/doing anything different from your pregnancy with Mira.

T- I do not have the words to express my feelings for you and your husband. Dealing with fertility issues is hard enough and to have additional stressors is heartbreaking. Please let me know if you ever need to talk. I cannot understand all that you’re dealing with but I am here to listen.

Anonymous- your loss is incredibly fresh. I feel you and hope you are getting the care you need during this hard time. I’m not sure how you felt but it has been an additional struggle to deal with Covid and the death of a baby. I wish I could say I’m staying strong but my days and nights are filled with sadness, anxiety, guilt and absolute fear of the future. Although I don’t think this is uncommon, it still feels unbearable. I’m hoping the edges soften over time. I heard that “Empt Cradle, Broken Heart” is helpful. I’ll look into the other. Sometimes others stories help but I also fear it will trigger a response in me I don’t want to resurface, specifically my guilt.

Thank you all. It means more than you can know. It pains me deeply that we are all here, having these conversations and feeling these things but community with others is the only true place I’m finding any peace. Regardless, this sucks and I hate it. Just had to say that.
July 6, 2020 | Unregistered CommenterEtta’s mom
Yes, my loss is still so fresh. It's hard to believe that it's been close to four months already -- some days it feels fast and other times it feels like forever. Your loss is also so fresh and I think everything that you're feeling is natural. If it's of any help, I also suffered from so much guilt and self-doubt. I spent the first two months literally going crazy with guilt. I spent countless hours just replaying the days before my delivery to figure out if there was anything that I did to trigger my labor, remembering the foods that I ate, questioning if I shouldn't have gone on that jog or walk, beating myself up for not going to the hospital sooner. I googled all day and night to find potential causes. Ultimately, I think any mother will blame herself and will feel this guilt.

Only in the last few weeks have I accepted that there wasn't anything that I could have done to save my baby. I think it took talking to multiple doctors and getting all my test results back to really get me to believe it. It has been difficult to get to this point, but I hope that with some time you can also find a way to let go of your guilt. I think it is so hard to accept but you did everything that you could for Etta. It's just the sad reality that sometimes this just happens. And as you so perfectly said, it sucks.

On your note about Covid, it sounds like we're feeling the same anxieties through this pandemic. I definitely feel like it heightened everything as my husband and I were so isolated. Our family lives far away so we couldn't see them and all of our friends were sheltering in place. I think the isolation deepened my grief and gave me way too much time to go into the holes of the internet which isn't healthy. I feel like with time that I've gotten better with our loss and it's helped me so much to talk to my family and friends regularly. Their support has gotten me through. Know that I'm here if you ever want to talk. I hope you can lean on your loved ones as well.
July 7, 2020 | Unregistered Commenteranonymous
Etta’s Mom,

Sorry it’s been a few days since I’ve been on here. Thank you for your condolences. Other babyloss moms understand in a way no one else can. In my language, Mira means ocean. We had sent off a piece of her baby blanket and a picture of her along with a raft with flowers into the water to memorialize her in those early days.

I agree with you- we ultimately decided the pain of never trying again would be worse than trying again and having another loss etc.

They never did identify why I had an abruption, however the MFM did say she looked at the placenta and it just wasn’t a healthy looking placenta. She wondered if the placenta just wasn’t “strong enough.” I did do several things differently with this pregnancy. I saw MFM, which was great bc they really understood our anxieties, stresses and concerns in a way that regular OB just can’t. They were so attentive and really made sure we were comfortable at each step to date. I started a baby aspirin (to support placental development) at 12 weeks and vaginal suppository progesterone at 16 weeks. The progesterone has been to help prevent preterm labor. I will continue this until 36 weeks. I got cervical measurements every 2 weeks starting at maybe 18 weeks until 24 weeks or something like that. We did all this bc although we presumed it was placental abruption, they couldn’t be 100% sure so we covered as many bases as possible. I will have a fetal growth scan at 32 weeks, which is also not standard.

I will say that I personally did some stuff differently too. I did not google anything scary. I did for sure in the months before i became pregnant but once I got that positive test, I just wanted to be in as good a mindset as possible for this peanut. It does no one any good to look at horror stories. Instead, I read about success stories and did pregnancy affirmations everyday. I meditated as often as I could and talked to him a lot. I asked my Mira to look out for him. I know some of it is.....maybe a little hokey, but for me, I needed that. If I had any questions, I did not google, I just sent messages to my MFM. And anytime I started to feel anxious, I’d ask my husband or good friends to remind me that this is a different pregnancy, different outcome. We would talk about the positive things that have happened in this pregnancy. I want to be clear, I don’t support toxic positivity and just being like “oh stop worrying, it’ll be fine.” But I did need to keep reminding myself that some thoughts were based in fear and the trauma we experienced rather than reality. I still have several weeks to go and I know I will continue to need them to do that for me.

I wish you all the love and fertility luck in the world. I’d love to support you in your journey any way I can.
July 11, 2020 | Unregistered CommenterMira’s mom
Dear Etta's mom,

So sorry about your baby. Your story really resonates with me and I've been thinking about you since reading it weeks ago. I also had a stillborn baby in April of this year. I am also 33 and have difficulty ovulating but am TTC. I wanted to share feelings of hope and solidarity.

To answer your questions, I didn't wait at all before ttc but nothing's happened yet. My milk dried up about 2 months after delivery but I still get an occasional drop.I got my period after 6 weeks since vaginal delivery, then not again and it's been several months but that's not unusual for me to not menstruate because I have PolyCystic Ovary Syndrome. I've never tried IVF, Traditional Chinese Medicine is my go-to, it's very gentle medicine. I've been seeing the same practitioner since my early 20s to help regulate my periods, but now I'm drinking the teas to help my body to heal. The dr told me my period would "not come back soon" so I'm just taking the time to recover but really wishing I was pregnant right now. I'm currently reading "Still' by Emma Hansen. It's alright but a bit heavy on the Christianity in my opinion.

t, I'm also sorry about your babies and really appreciate you sharing your story of struggle to conceive after loss.. I feel like this website is sometimes a bit heavy on the "rainbow babies take the pain away" discourse, especially the ttc section. I get a bit down to hear and read about people getting pregnant so easily (must be nice, Mira's mom! lol jk happy for you) because I know it probably won't be like that for me. I already considered myself extremely lucky to have gotten pregnant, and I realistically don't know if I will ever get to be again. If my story unravels like yours, t, I would be more likely to adopt, I'm already strongly considering it.

My midwife told me about a family who suffered loss then filed for adoption while ttc, they managed to procreate and the adoption went through so both lil ones arrived around the same time. Cute!

Anyway, hang in there folx my thoughts are with you hoping we manage to have good sex again just for fun.
July 21, 2020 | Unregistered CommenterM