for one and all > grief vs. depression - crossing a line, finding the bottom. or what?
Jenni, interesting, I'm just now interviewing a grief therapist for this site and she just said one of her jobs is to try and sort out what is grief and what is depression. Could be a professional could sift this mess easier than you, so I'm glad to see you're seeing someone already -- I hope they have some answers.
I wrote a post on my decision to take antidepressants here:
http://www.glowinthewoods.com/home/2008/6/9/how-i-knew.html
And I think *my* breaking point was when my brain stopped fighting what my body was doing. That is, I was lying in bed, and instead of my brain saying "get the fuck up already! You need to get out of bed! I know it sucks!" my brain said, "eh, whatever. Lie here. See if I care." There was no fight left in me, no where, not in a single fiber of my being. I wasn't necessarily "a danger to myself or others," but in essence, by lying there and having my brain switch off, I kinda was. I think we all have our breaking points, and I think talking through them here (and in therapy) is a really good idea.
Best to you. Please come back and let us know how you're doing. Whatever happens, please know that you're not alone and you can always find someone here to talk to.
I wrote a post on my decision to take antidepressants here:
http://www.glowinthewoods.com/home/2008/6/9/how-i-knew.html
And I think *my* breaking point was when my brain stopped fighting what my body was doing. That is, I was lying in bed, and instead of my brain saying "get the fuck up already! You need to get out of bed! I know it sucks!" my brain said, "eh, whatever. Lie here. See if I care." There was no fight left in me, no where, not in a single fiber of my being. I wasn't necessarily "a danger to myself or others," but in essence, by lying there and having my brain switch off, I kinda was. I think we all have our breaking points, and I think talking through them here (and in therapy) is a really good idea.
Best to you. Please come back and let us know how you're doing. Whatever happens, please know that you're not alone and you can always find someone here to talk to.
June 16, 2009 |
tash
tash
I think tash nailed it: I knew that I was grieving and not depressed because I could do the very little tiny things that indicated I was moving forward. As small a task as showering or feeding myself a meal became a big triumph. I knew that if -- when -- I stopped doing those things; if -- when -- my brain said, "eff it" I would need to seek more help. I went back to "work" (I freelanced and worked at home) about three or four months after Gabriel died. That was huge, a real turning point. It wasn't the light at the end of the tunnel or anything, but when I realized I wanted to be engaged in something besides grieving, and that if I chose I could engage in something else, well... it made me realize that I was going to survive this. I wasn't sure about that for quite some time. I wasn't sure I wanted to for quite some time.
It's good to know you are questioning this. It's good to know you are engaging in therapy. I would consider those hopeful signs. But there's nothing wrong with deciding to move forward with antidepressants. You'll know what your line is, the one that if you cross it, you'll just need something outside to keep you moving. And that's okay. They are just another tool that we use if we need to.
Good luck. let us know how you are.
ciao,
rpm
It's good to know you are questioning this. It's good to know you are engaging in therapy. I would consider those hopeful signs. But there's nothing wrong with deciding to move forward with antidepressants. You'll know what your line is, the one that if you cross it, you'll just need something outside to keep you moving. And that's okay. They are just another tool that we use if we need to.
Good luck. let us know how you are.
ciao,
rpm
June 16, 2009 |
red pen mama
red pen mama
I am having problems with anger more than depression, to the point where I'm beginning to wonder what's wrong with me. That, and the bizarre paranoia about pregnancy - I'm on birth control and we barely have sex anymore anyway, but honestly, this is the third or fourth time where I swear I've felt the start of motions down there in my belly, panicking and thinking "Oh dear G-d, it's failed again" (my other pregnancies were due to birth control failure) and being too scared to even go buy a test, because in my still quasi-rational head I'm pretty sure I'm not pregnant, and in my panicked, irrational head I am both frightened to death and secretly I think a little hopeful that once again a decision will be taken out of my hands.
I've never been a big fan of drugs - even going back on birth control once again was a huge argument with myself, I've never ever had good luck with any kind of prescription - but I am considering seeing some kind of therapist. I've talked with lots of different people, read here, everything unofficial I can think of, but the fact is only I can finally decide whether to get help or not, and whether that help will include drugs. The OB/GYN prescribed an antidepressant and a sleep aid when we found out that the baby would not be alive at delivery, but they literally sat in my cabinet until a couple of months ago when I brought the filled prescriptions back to the office and asked them to throw them out (I don't flush stuff down the toilet - call me an eco crazy or whatever, it might just be that I'm anal retentive...) because I couldn't bring myself to take them.
The one thing that seemed to help me, running at the gym, is gone due to other things - which it's probably about a month or so after we cut the membership that I started feeling this horrible rage again, and it's been building ever since. If we lived somewhere it was safe to run on the sidewalk or whatever it might be okay still but no gym means no running now. That physical activity helped immensely with the anger, but I don't know if it would help you with depression or not.
I've never been a big fan of drugs - even going back on birth control once again was a huge argument with myself, I've never ever had good luck with any kind of prescription - but I am considering seeing some kind of therapist. I've talked with lots of different people, read here, everything unofficial I can think of, but the fact is only I can finally decide whether to get help or not, and whether that help will include drugs. The OB/GYN prescribed an antidepressant and a sleep aid when we found out that the baby would not be alive at delivery, but they literally sat in my cabinet until a couple of months ago when I brought the filled prescriptions back to the office and asked them to throw them out (I don't flush stuff down the toilet - call me an eco crazy or whatever, it might just be that I'm anal retentive...) because I couldn't bring myself to take them.
The one thing that seemed to help me, running at the gym, is gone due to other things - which it's probably about a month or so after we cut the membership that I started feeling this horrible rage again, and it's been building ever since. If we lived somewhere it was safe to run on the sidewalk or whatever it might be okay still but no gym means no running now. That physical activity helped immensely with the anger, but I don't know if it would help you with depression or not.
June 17, 2009 |
anonymous too
anonymous too
Hello Jenni,
I wish that I had something helpful to say about this one but sadly I don't. I just wanted to say that it is incredibly confusing and that you aren't on your own in trying to differentiate between grief and depression. I really feel for you.
I was very strongly advised to take medication from about two weeks after I lost my daughter. I felt (and acted) as though I had fallen through the floor. I was not really in any fit state to debate whether taking medication was a good idea, or even an appropriate one. I just did what I was told to do. Like you, I don't have a great family history. My own mother developed severe post partum psychosis after I was born (I have always known how to make an entrance, what can I say?) and bipolar runs in the family although I don't have it myself. I think these factors might have encouraged the doctors to prescribe to me so immediately. With hindsight, I feel it was far too soon to take that step. I wasn't depressed, I was grieving.
I've taken various strengths and combinations of medication ever since and it has been nearly ten months now. I can't honestly say if they helped or not as I have never been without them apart from those first two weeks (which would have been horrific anyway). I do worry that, if and when, I stop taking medication I will fall apart as I never 'hit the bottom' as you say. Perhaps I haven't even started to grieve? I found a few of the side effects very unhelpful but they did seem to ease the rawness a little.
I did find talking about what had happened very, very useful. As Tash suggests, perhaps your therapist might be able to help you sort through it all. You know where the edge is for you and, in my own humble opinion, make a grab for anything, anything at all, that will stop you walking right off it.
Look after yourself, I hope you find the right combination of things that will help.
xxx
I wish that I had something helpful to say about this one but sadly I don't. I just wanted to say that it is incredibly confusing and that you aren't on your own in trying to differentiate between grief and depression. I really feel for you.
I was very strongly advised to take medication from about two weeks after I lost my daughter. I felt (and acted) as though I had fallen through the floor. I was not really in any fit state to debate whether taking medication was a good idea, or even an appropriate one. I just did what I was told to do. Like you, I don't have a great family history. My own mother developed severe post partum psychosis after I was born (I have always known how to make an entrance, what can I say?) and bipolar runs in the family although I don't have it myself. I think these factors might have encouraged the doctors to prescribe to me so immediately. With hindsight, I feel it was far too soon to take that step. I wasn't depressed, I was grieving.
I've taken various strengths and combinations of medication ever since and it has been nearly ten months now. I can't honestly say if they helped or not as I have never been without them apart from those first two weeks (which would have been horrific anyway). I do worry that, if and when, I stop taking medication I will fall apart as I never 'hit the bottom' as you say. Perhaps I haven't even started to grieve? I found a few of the side effects very unhelpful but they did seem to ease the rawness a little.
I did find talking about what had happened very, very useful. As Tash suggests, perhaps your therapist might be able to help you sort through it all. You know where the edge is for you and, in my own humble opinion, make a grab for anything, anything at all, that will stop you walking right off it.
Look after yourself, I hope you find the right combination of things that will help.
xxx
June 18, 2009 |
Catherine
Catherine
hi everyone. thank you so much for your thoughtful replies. i so appreciate it.
tash, i went and read your blogpost. it made so much sense to me. i have a stepdaughter at home - she is in grade school - and i am still functioning enough to care for her in the afternoons and evenings. i've been kind of using that as a gauge, a way to know that i'm not off the edge yet. i'm very glad for you that you were able to recognize your "help!" moment and get the ADs.
and yes, exercise helps me. a lot. it's just that there are days when i can't make it happen. and then i get into a bad cycle. if i knew a way to take care of everything else and also workout for an hour a day no matter what, things might look different...
i had my first appointment with a therapist today. it was helpful, and i feel grateful to have found her. she specializes in pregnancy loss, is a dbm herself, and is very tuned in to the physicality of grief. we talked about my symptoms and she thinks i'm showing signs of trauma/PTSD more than depression (tho they aren't mutually exclusive). that makes total sense to me. i think she'll be able to keep an eye on me, help me sort it out a bit. just knowing that i will have a space to go talk for an hour a week already feels better.
one of the things she pointed out (no fun) is that no matter who we are, no matter what resources we've got, this grief is going to do its thing to us. there is no getting out of it. there's no rushing it. there's no controlling it. all we can do is stay present, take care of ourselves, get support, process however we can, try to trust that it's going to get better.
she's right. but you know - yuck.
thanks for listening. love to everyone here.
tash, i went and read your blogpost. it made so much sense to me. i have a stepdaughter at home - she is in grade school - and i am still functioning enough to care for her in the afternoons and evenings. i've been kind of using that as a gauge, a way to know that i'm not off the edge yet. i'm very glad for you that you were able to recognize your "help!" moment and get the ADs.
and yes, exercise helps me. a lot. it's just that there are days when i can't make it happen. and then i get into a bad cycle. if i knew a way to take care of everything else and also workout for an hour a day no matter what, things might look different...
i had my first appointment with a therapist today. it was helpful, and i feel grateful to have found her. she specializes in pregnancy loss, is a dbm herself, and is very tuned in to the physicality of grief. we talked about my symptoms and she thinks i'm showing signs of trauma/PTSD more than depression (tho they aren't mutually exclusive). that makes total sense to me. i think she'll be able to keep an eye on me, help me sort it out a bit. just knowing that i will have a space to go talk for an hour a week already feels better.
one of the things she pointed out (no fun) is that no matter who we are, no matter what resources we've got, this grief is going to do its thing to us. there is no getting out of it. there's no rushing it. there's no controlling it. all we can do is stay present, take care of ourselves, get support, process however we can, try to trust that it's going to get better.
she's right. but you know - yuck.
thanks for listening. love to everyone here.
June 18, 2009 |
Jenni
Jenni
how do you differentiate between grief and depression? or do you? did you ever hit a point where you thought, ok now i need pharmaceutical help? did it distance you from your grief? did you feel like a "depression" diagnosis was pathologizing your sadness? or did meds help you? save you?
clinical depression runs in my family. since my loss i've been fighting hard to practice good selfcare - to avoid a trip to serotonin deprivation land. and now i'm totally crashing. not taking good care of myself. not achieving small daily goals. not caring about much. i'm not sure whether to just let myself fall, fall, fall. maybe i haven't been letting myself fully feel it. maybe i need to hit bottom in order to start swimming to the surface. maybe down is the place to be.
or maybe not. maybe i'm in bad shape. maybe this is dangerous, and i need to seek help, pharma help. maybe this has nothing to do with respecting the grief process and meds would just be a healthy step.
i am starting to see a therapist and to get regular bodywork. so some kind of help is on the way. but i'm trying to watch myself, my process. i know grief is ugly and unwanted in our world and i'm trying to resist "cheer up" mode, trying to respect the time it takes me to walk through this horrible mess of missing my girl, this missing that will never end. but - i don't want to walk right off the edge.
thanks for listening everyone. any thoughts or stories you can share would be wonderful. anonymous responses are totally okay - i'm sure there are lots of different opinions and emotions on this topic.